Are faith, God and love without deeds, dead?
Paul took the position that salvation could be gained on faith alone. James took the position that faith without works and deeds is dead. Even if one had faith, like demons and Satan must, without works they were still going to hell.
Most have landed with James who said that faith without deeds and works was dead. This may be due to Jesus who said that we would recognize his people by their works.
Love, it would seem to me, has the same characteristic as faith. Love without works and deeds is dead. Be it love for a spouse, our children, parents or friends or even God, if we did not do works and deeds, they could not know that we love them. At the very least, we would have to tell them we love them and that falls into works and deeds.
Many believers tell me that God is love or loves us all. They always point to deeds and works that fall in the range of un-provable miracles. Most of these miracles are in the ancient past. Creation and what not. Some take it to the present and I have been told often that God can do whatever he wants with us because he made us. I discard this out of hand because I believe that if that were true, God would not also create all those things that kill us and cause us to suffer. That is not a loving act.
Love, human to human, must have ongoing deeds and works to be alive. Without these, love is dead.
Love, God to human, must also have ongoing works and deeds. If God is alive, he must and would express his love with viable and recognizable actions.
If we cannot see these acts on God’s part --- and you agree that love must be expressed somehow with works and deeds, ----does that mean that God does not love or that he is dead?
Regards
DL
Christians absorb the deity of Christ in his death, and they have him as a source of guidance and compassion from Heaven through any spiritual rebirth. It is the same phylosophy and compassion of the Buddha. You must contimplate the phylosophy of eternal life to recieve the compassion.
Thanks for ignoring the issue.
That speaks volumes.
Regards
DL
Try not to read too much into it there champ. I'm just trying to help.
You asked "Are faith, God and love without deeds, dead?" I answered" Christians absorb the deity of Christ in his death, and they have him as a source of guidance and compassion from Heaven through any spiritual rebirth. It is the same phylosophy and compassion of the Buddha. You must contimplate the phylosophy of eternal life to recieve the compassion. "
The deed was Christ. You have to contimplate the phylosophy of eternal life to understand the love of God, which is the same as the love of Buddha through the same phylosophy.
Last edited by Bag-Of-Hammers; 01-27-2012 at 09:10 PM.
Jesus came to earth to make everyone live within the phylosophy of life eternal. By doing so, he proves that Buddha was correct about the eternal soul. Buddhism teaches that a Byuddhist goes through many different kinds of spiritual deaths, rebirths and the between, in preperation for the unltimate in death- between. Buddhists teach that while living within Christ, and by taking Christ into our hearts, we too live the same phylosophy, and are reborn anew. In order to understand God's compassion, or love, is to be able to contimplate and live within the phylosophy of life eternal. That's when you understand that God's love goes way beyond this life and clear into the next. The deeds of Christ and everything he taught was what delivers people into understanding this amazing compassion.
Last edited by Bag-Of-Hammers; 01-27-2012 at 10:24 PM.
Jesus came to earth to make everyone live within the phylosophy of life eternal. By doing so, he proves that Buddha was correct about the eternal soul. Buddhism teaches that a Byuddhist goes through many different kinds of spiritual deaths, rebirths and the between, in preperation for the unltimate in death- between. Buddhists teach that while living within Christ, and by taking Christ into our hearts, we too live the same phylosophy, and are reborn anew. In order to understand God's compassion, or love, is to be able to contimplate and live within the phylosophy of life eternal. That's when you understand that God's love goes way beyond this life and clear into the next. The deeds of Christ and everything he taught was what delivers people into understanding this amazing compassion.
There is truth in mythology. Sometimes there is no other way to explain the spirit. It's a very useful tool. Jesus is God's charecter in his story. It's up to you to determine who this Jesus charecter is and what does he represent. In the case of the NT, he represents the phylosophy of life eternal, among others. What is the phylosophy of Jesus and what does he do? He saves people in what way? What is the phylosophy of eternal life, and what is it like to live the phylosophy?
Last edited by Bag-Of-Hammers; 01-29-2012 at 06:58 PM.
Weather the story of Jesus was true or not, he still is a deliverance of God's love. I personally can't see how you can fake that kind thing tho. The Prophets were there for Jesus. He lived the same phylosophy as the Prophets, in that he a had the same kind of relationship with God as they did. A very intimate relationship. Unfortunately, it was Moses's crazy man made laws that were inflicted upon him, killing him. He did stand against the laws, stating how nobody follows them, but followers of the OT interpreted the laws in their own way. And the OT is the most dangerous, irresponsible piece of garbage there ever was. The idea of me being more infallible than Jesus in thinking this gives me pause. I mean, Jesus was so adament at pointing out failures of other doctrines and/or practices, but he never got around to picking apart the OT, when it is the OT that brought about his crucifixion. It is an enigma. He is still the spirit of eternal life, and he exists in Heaven along with every other deity ever created. Jesus is my most entrusted consort in Heaven. I pray to him and he listens and talks to me from Heaven.
Last edited by Bag-Of-Hammers; 01-29-2012 at 07:46 PM.
The OT brought about the crucifixion. Maybe he Jesus was worshipping the God of the OT to the letter by being the one who is victimized by his own God/religion. He gave himself over to those laws. I bet he didn't have a choice tho. He was destined to be the one who broke the laws of Moses, and was killed for it, just as the OT instructs them to do. They are instructed to hate Jesus. The dogma is antichrist as anything there ever was. I am starting to think that Jesus didn't speak out against it because if he did, it would just give them another excuse to trump up yet another reason to hate him. He didn't need to do anything to get them to hate him. They hated him because that is what Moses and his God wanted. Jesus was truly a victim of of a false prophet and his bad dogma. To whom everyone showers love upon, including Jesus himself, apparently . Jesus seemed to love Moses and hiis God, and all the prophets as much as the Jews that were following the OT's influence of being antichrist. They loved and followed the God of the OT in their own way, making them all perfectly faithful to their God, or their own version of God. Jesus's way was clearly against the rules. Jesus had absolutely no freedom of religion. He wans't allowed to be who he was. The OT states he is to be hated and not allowed to live.
Last edited by Bag-Of-Hammers; 01-29-2012 at 08:52 PM.
There is truth in mythology. Sometimes there is no other way to explain the spirit. It's a very useful tool. Jesus is God's charecter in his story. It's up to you to determine who this Jesus charecter is and what does he represent. In the case of the NT, he represents the phylosophy of life eternal, among others. What is the phylosophy of Jesus and what does he do? He saves people in what way? What is the phylosophy of eternal life, and what is it like to live the phylosophy?
All unknown but what I do know is that vicarious redemption is quite immoral both to offer it as well as accept it.
Weather the story of Jesus was true or not, he still is a deliverance of God's love. I personally can't see how you can fake that kind thing tho. The Prophets were there for Jesus. He lived the same phylosophy as the Prophets, in that he a had the same kind of relationship with God as they did. A very intimate relationship. Unfortunately, it was Moses's crazy man made laws that were inflicted upon him, killing him. He did stand against the laws, stating how nobody follows them, but followers of the OT interpreted the laws in their own way. And the OT is the most dangerous, irresponsible piece of garbage there ever was. The idea of me being more infallible than Jesus in thinking this gives me pause. I mean, Jesus was so adament at pointing out failures of other doctrines and/or practices, but he never got around to picking apart the OT, when it is the OT that brought about his crucifixion. It is an enigma. He is still the spirit of eternal life, and he exists in Heaven along with every other deity ever created. Jesus is my most entrusted consort in Heaven. I pray to him and he listens and talks to me from Heaven.
I agree that the O T, as interpreted by Christianity, is crap.
As interpreted by those who have more authotiry over interpreting it, the Jews, it is rather good.
First, they are not foolish enough to take it literally.
The OT brought about the crucifixion. Maybe he Jesus was worshipping the God of the OT to the letter by being the one who is victimized by his own God/religion. He gave himself over to those laws. I bet he didn't have a choice tho. He was destined to be the one who broke the laws of Moses, .
What do you think of Jesus' divorce law?
Let no man put asunder.
Do you think that people forced to stay married is a good law?
Who is this “man”? Who is the one promoting the separation? Can anybody outside the marriage divorce the husband and wife if they themselves did not want to be divorced? Of course not! You may be able to physically separate the husband and wife from each other, but not the marriage or “oneness” that they possess in their hearts. The “man” in Matthew 19:3b, 6b are the marriage partners. “Therefore what God has joined together, let not ...[the marriage partners] ...separate” (Matthew 19:6b). The Scripture is saying, concerning a God-ordained marriage, not to let the original desire to separate or divorce, grow out of the husband's or wife's heart. The Scripture does NOT say, “therefore what God has joined together, let not GOD separate,” but “let not man (the marriage partners) separate” out of self-gratification.
There is a vast difference between us doing something from our own self-gratification, and us carrying out the loving will of our heavenly Father. The very actions themselves that we carry out may appear to “look” the same, but the unseen part that makes the difference between a sinful act and a righteous act, is the desire of your heart. DIVORCE ITSELF IS NOT WRONG, BUT WHEN IT’S USED FOR SELFISH PLEASURE, IT IS!
Last edited by Bag-Of-Hammers; 01-29-2012 at 11:11 PM.
Jesus doesn't make laws like the prophets do. You are allowed to hate Jesus. Jesus's law was to love God with all your heart. He was not a control freak. That is why is such a perfect Heavenly being. He is not a Moses or a Muhammad constaltly ordering you around or else face stoning to death. Jesus is NOT big brother. Jesus was a victim of big brother.
Who is this “man”? Who is the one promoting the separation? Can anybody outside the marriage divorce the husband and wife if they themselves did not want to be divorced? Of course not! You may be able to physically separate the husband and wife from each other, but not the marriage or “oneness” that they possess in their hearts. The “man” in Matthew 19:3b, 6b are the marriage partners. “Therefore what God has joined together, let not ...[the marriage partners] ...separate” (Matthew 19:6b). The Scripture is saying, concerning a God-ordained marriage, not to let the original desire to separate or divorce, grow out of the husband's or wife's heart. The Scripture does NOT say, “therefore what God has joined together, let not GOD separate,” but “let not man (the marriage partners) separate” out of self-gratification.
There is a vast difference between us doing something from our own self-gratification, and us carrying out the loving will of our heavenly Father. The very actions themselves that we carry out may appear to “look” the same, but the unseen part that makes the difference between a sinful act and a righteous act, is the desire of your heart. DIVORCE ITSELF IS NOT WRONG, BUT WHEN IT’S USED FOR SELFISH PLEASURE, IT IS!
If a wife divorces a man who beats her, is she divorcing for self-gratification?
Yes she is.
Is that wrong?
If a wife divorces a man who beats her, is she divorcing for self-gratification?
Yes she is.
Is that wrong?
Regards
DL
THat would not be out of selfish pleasure, but out of personal safety and sanity. I think by self gratification they mean out of a desire for sex with others, and such. Instead of running off with the secretary kind of thing.
THat would not be out of selfish pleasure, but out of personal safety and sanity. I think by self gratification they mean out of a desire for sex with others, and such. Instead of running off with the secretary kind of thing.
Would Jesus be quick to break his rule and give her a divorce?
Are faith, God and love without deeds, dead?
