Jews Only: How do you explain these verses from torah?
3But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
4And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
Genesis 3:3-4
In your explanation please include if that gave the man ability or inherent quality to sin?
avid: Thanks ..Could u please also tell me if it is consistent with the christian belief of inheritance of the ability to sin from this happening?
First .. this question was meant for JEWS ... why do Christians answer? did i ask for Ur point of view?
For the first christian who answered ... u answer .. but then u start and inter religion fight ?
for the second christian dormants how come if Urey right .. then without me mentioning "original sin" people recognized it?? Either way it is not for u to answer ... but loo kin at the enthusiasm of Christians ill ask a christian ONLY answer too ) Lets Jews answer here .. its their book
reclined: So when kids are born are they sinful ?? or does it mean that till they reach a mental maturity to decide .. they are not held accountable for their s ins? Thirdly was Adam forgiven for what he did? and fourthly .. can u explain the messiah concept .. after his coming would u go spiritually and physically to heaven again?
God knew they would eat of the tree before He formed them, Adam and Eve and the evil one. God gives us the ability to do anything. How we learn to live righteous lives can only come about as He plans our lives out for us.. to teach us right from wrong...why to choose righteousness..and why to live for God.
I'm not a Jew, I'm Yahdaim and I'd like to join in this discussion.
The fruit in the garden are symbolic of teachings.
The tree of life was strictly following the every word of Yahweh.
The tree of Righteousness and Evil is the mixture that you see worldly religions teaching today that have a form of holiness, yet they include teachings for ancient pagan customs. These practices are condemned in the Holy Scriptures.
Our Savior Yahshua Messiah stated in Matthew 3:10"The Axe is already laid at the root of the trees; therefore every tree that does not bear righteous fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire."
Mark 8:24
And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking.
Prov 15:4
A wholesome tongue is a tree of life: but perverseness therein is a breaking of the spirit.
Righteousness is described in...
Duet 6:25 It will be righteousness for us if we are careful to observe all these laws before Yahweh our Father, just as He commanded us.
When mother Eve allowed herself to be influenced by the adversary to disobey the commands of Yahweh, she willingly sinned.
I John 3:4 Whosoever committee sin transgressed also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
Yahweh placed both trees in the garden to test and to prove mankind. He wanted to know who would obey him and who would be allowed to be led astray buy teachings that are not written in the Scriptures. Yahweh created the earth as a training ground for mankind to pr oven themselves worthy for positions in Yahweh's soon coming Kingdom.
Yahweh gave us a choice to obey him, and He gave us a warning of disobeying Him and becoming a servant of Satan because you belong to whom you obey Rom 6:16.
Take His warning seriously.
Deuteronomy 30:15-20?
15 See, I have set before you this day life
by righteousness, and death and destruction__
16 In that I command you this day to
love Yahweh your Father, by walking in all
His ways, by keeping His Laws, His statutes,
and His judgments, so that you may live and
multiply, and so Yahweh your Father may
bless you in the land which you go in to
possess.
17 But if your heart turns away, and you
are not obedient, and you are drawn away to
submit to gods (Elohim), to worship them
by serving them__
18 I declare to you this day that you will
surely perish; you will not prolong your days
in the land which you cross over the Yardan
to possess.
19 I call heaven and earth as witnesses
against you this day, that I have set before
you life and death, blessings and curses.
Because you are free agents to make your
own choice between righteousness and
evil therefore choose life, so both you and
your children may live;
20 So you may love Yahweh your Father,
by listening to Him, and then obeying Him.
Hold fast to Him, for He is your life. He will
also give you many years in the land He vowed
to give to your fathers; to Abraham, Isaac,
and Yaaqob.
Psalm 86:12
I will give thanks to You, O Yahweh my Father, with all my heart, And will GLORIFY YOUR NAME FOREVER. (I will not try to hide your name like a Jew named Sue.
Blasphemy is the saying that you worship Yahweh while you practice breaking His Laws FYI.
I think what you were trying to say Sue was why do I use Yahweh's name in vain, vanity means to bring to nothing and that is exactly what you are doing if you do not use and magnify Yahweh's name
Gd meant that the as yet immortal man would someday die, as a result of no longer living in the Garden of Eden, where he was immortal. The (eventual) termination of life was the result of having eaten of the forbidden tree.
The serpent said: it isn't poisonous, you won't take a bite and fall down dead. The serpent was, as are all serpents in Judeo-Christian mythology, a liar and a cheat. a "snake in the grass", if you will.
Does this mean that man has the inherent quality to sin? Hmm no. We do not look at this as "original sin" as Christians do. Man is and always was imperfect, as illustrated by the fact that he and Eve were able to break the rules in the first place.
The great sin was, by the way, NOT so much the disobedience against Gd's commandment as the desire to be equal to Gd, (a theme repeated in the Tower of Babel story).
YUHATEME: The question was directed at Jewish people to get the Jewish point of view....why do you insist on adding a Christian one? That wasn't the point of the question.
And why do you insist on pronouncing (and using as your avatar) the unpronounceable Name? Kinda blasphemy, donation?NJ
***Some ideas that might shed more light to the topic (scroll down to skip to the answer):
The first thing you have to remember is that just about everything in the Torah has a deeper meaning than it's literal meaning. We don't know what the garden of Eden was like, because obviously after Adam and Eve ate the fruit they got kicked out, and we as mankind have been out of the garden
ever since. We can't imagine what it was like in the garden, but what we do know that the Physical and Spiritual worlds were not distinct in the Garden of Eden. Today we see only the physical world and the spiritual world is hidden from us, but when we redeem ourselves as mankind then the Messiah will come and we will once again return to the Garden of Eden. (That is one somewhat widespread belief of what will happen when the Messiah comes, that what i personally believe but no one knows exactly what will happen, it's all just educated guessing).
Anyway, another important idea that you need to know to fully understand this is the basic principle of Judaism. Basically, G-d is infinite. He has no concept of space and time because he is all of space and all of time. When something is infinite it will take up all the space no matter how far you go and the meaning of space will not even exist. The same goes for time. G-d always was and always will be. Eternal, infinite. The concept is impossible to imagine because we are created to be finite.
We are created in a finite form, but when it says that man is made in the image of G-d, that does not mean physical, obviously, because G-d is infinite and can't be confined to a finite form. Man is made in the image of G-d spiritually and mentally. G-d gave Man free will to choose between Good and Evil, and Right and Wrong. Before the creation of the world there was only G-d and He was everything and he was Good, so everything was Good. When G-d gave Man free will to choose, he gave Man the ability to choose wrong, to choose evil over good. If G-d wanted to he could have created Adam in such a way that Adam had no choice but to believe in G-d, but then there would be no options and no free will, and the entire course of mankind's existence would have been predetermined at the moment of creation, and all of creation would have simply dissolved back into G-d, because if all of creation was just as good as G-d then there would be no separation between G-d and his creation, and the creation would cease to exist. Basically, by giving Man free will G-d brought Evil into existence, because there have to be at least two options in order for free will to exist: good and evil. If there is only good, then you don't need free will, because you can't use it anyway.
***So, now, let me answer your question:
The serpent represents the "Yetzer Hara" (the evil inclination). The serpent basically just straight up lies to Eve and says "oh yeah, G-d won't do anything, you can eat the fruit." So Eve believes the serpent and takes the fruit. When she sees that she can touch it and nothing happens, she figures she can probably eat it and nothing will happen. So she does, and she gives some to Adam. Then what happens? Adam and Eve realize that they are naked. This is because when they ate the fruit the spiritual world was hidden from them and they only saw their physical bodies when they looked at themselves or each other. So they became ashamed and they tried to cover up, and then G-d comes over them and says something like, "Where are you?" This is interesting that G-d should say that because as G-d He knows exactly where Adam is, but he also knows that Adam is trying to hide from Him. But you can't hide from G-d, G-d is everywhere. So when G-d says "Where are you" he is basically playing along with Adam. Then Adam says, "i saw that I'm naked and i was ashamed." G-d: "How did you know you were naked, did you eat from the tree?" Adam: "yes, eve gave it to me." Eve: "the serpent tricked me!" And then G-d punished Adam, Eve, and the serpent.
The fruit came from the "Tree of Knowledge", this knowledge is the knowledge of Good and Evil. So after Adam and Eve ate the the fruit they learned what Good and Evil meant. However, the capacity to sin- the ability to sin, was already there before they ate the fruit. That came with free will, but until you use your free will for evil over good for the first time, you can't know the difference between evil and good. So the first sin was necessary for Mankind to understand our free will, but the free will / ability to sin came before that.
Jews Only: How do you explain these verses from torah?
) Lets Jews answer here .. its their book
