Go Back   Religion Board > Other Organized Religions > Latter Day Saints - Mormonism


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 02-28-2009, 06:04 PM
snugglebunny_in_denmark's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,630
Default For Mormons, Who exactly is responsible for the creation of the world?

Compare the Book of Moses with the Book of Abraham. Both of these books are printed in the Pearl of Great Price?one of the four standard works of the Mormon church. The Book of Abraham was supposed to have been given some years after the Book of Moses. Both books are supposed to contain a direct revelation concerning the creation of the world. While the Book of Moses states that "I, God" created the heavens and the earth, the Book of Abraham states that "they (the Gods)" created them.
(Moses 2:1, 3, 10, 25; 3:8)
(Abraham 3:15; 4:3, 10, 25; 5:8)
One God
Book of Mormon
Alma 11:27-39, 44
2 Nephi 31:21
Mormon 7:7
3 Nephi11:27
Testimony of Three Witnesses

Plural Gods
Doctrine and Covenants
Section 121:32
Section 132:18-20, 37

God is a Spirit
Book of Mormon
Alma 18:26-28
Alma 22:8-11

God Has a Body
Doctrine and Covenants
Section 130:22
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 03-01-2009, 06:04 PM
penelope m's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,657
My understanding is that Mormons consider there to be only one god but that he is hard to define as one.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2009, 06:04 PM
Steph S's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,581
You should ask the Mormons to state how long they've been with the Mormon church. Many of their doctrines or secrets aren't revealed to them unless they've been their a while. (even those born within it don't learn about some stuff about their religion until their senior year. I'm not sure about the girls)
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 03-07-2009, 06:04 PM
clusium1971's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,623
Ummm...isn't it obvious? God created the world.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 03-08-2009, 07:04 PM
Ambivalent Bittern PJA's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,576
Mormons believes, after this life, they become gods themselves
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 03-10-2009, 07:04 PM
ultimatealmightyone's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,673
Do you believe in Mormon scripture? If not, why do you care? If so, I'll give you a hint. Mormons believe in two creations: a spiritual creation and a physical creation. The Book of Moses is referring to the spiritual creation and the book of Abraham is referring to the physical creation. Mormons belief indicates that God the Father is responsible for the spiritual creation and Jesus Christ was responsible for the physical.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 03-13-2009, 07:04 PM
goodbooksmelbourne's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,681
We believe God the Father commanded Christ to create the earth, under the direction of the Father. Christ is the God of this earth, God the Father is our Father in Heaven who created our spirits, along with our Heavenly Mother. The book of Moses is Christ talking, the book of Abraham is talking about God and Christ...
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 03-17-2009, 07:04 PM
Cyndy E's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,660
Christ had a simple word for this.[vanity[. meaning us less and as well Christ stated can the blind lead the blind leave them alone. read the links below. WNW.packmanteleport.com WNW.nomanknowsmystory.com WNW/exmormonnomore.com WNW.the_tanners.com based on fact .teaching of the church as well doctrines as well based on fact..
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 03-18-2009, 07:04 PM
Doctor Y's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,634
Are you really trying to discredit the church based on wording? Seriously, this is all you have? Because one says I, and the other they? That's it? Seriously? Look, many times in the Bible, God and Jesus are used interchangeably. But the Book of Mormon can't do the same? James E Talmage said: "Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are as distinct in their persons and individuality's as are any three personages in mortality. Yet their unity of purpose and operation is such as to make their edicts one, and their will the will of God."

So it is no sup rise, that the scriptures refer to them either as one (I), or as three (they).
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 03-20-2009, 07:04 PM
Archie D's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,592
The Book of Moses, is a collection of parts taken from Gensis that Joseph Smith res translated by the power of God. It was not a "revelation," as you say, to Joseph from God, like unto the manner the Doctrine and Covenants is. It is a re translation, meaning, it is originally what was to have been.

The Book of Abraham, again, not a "revelation from God," as you say. It was a translation by Joseph, through the power of God, of some ancient texts written on papyri, purchased by the prophet Joseph Smith from one Michael Chandler in 1835.

Moses 2:
1 AND it came to pass that the Lord spake unto Moses, saying: Behold, I reveal unto you concerning this heaven, and this earth; write the words which I speak. I am the Beginning and the End, the Almighty God; BY MINE ONLY BEGOTTEN I HAVE CREATED these things; yea, in the beginning I created the heaven, and the earth upon which thou stand est.

God is stating that He created the worlds through His Son.

I think you misquoted Abraham 3:15 which states:

And the Lord said unto me: Abraham, I show these things unto thee before ye go into Egypt, that ye may declare all these words. - this chapter tells about the "Prue-existence" which is where we dwelt with God before coming to earth.

I will read on in Abraham 3:

19 And the Lord said unto me: These two facts do exist, that there are two spirits, one being more intelligent than the other; there shall be another more intelligent than they; I am the Lord thy God, I am more intelligent than they all.

20 The Lord thy God sent his angel to deliver thee from the hands of the priest of Elkenah.

21 I dwell in the midst of them all; I now, therefore, have come down unto thee to declare unto thee the works which my hands have made, wherein my wisdom excelled them all, for I rule in the heavens above, and in the earth beneath, in all wisdom and prudence, over all the intelligences thine eyes have seen from the beginning; I came down in the beginning in the midst of all the intelligences thou hast seen.

22 Now the Lord had shown unto me, Abraham, the intelligences that were organized before the world was; and among all these there were many of the noble and great ones;

23 And God saw these souls that they were good, and he stood in the midst of them, and he said: These I will make my rulers; for he stood among those that were spirits, and he saw that they were good; and he said unto me: Abraham, thou art one of them; thou wast chosen before thou wast born.

24 And there stood one among them that was like unto God, and he said unto those who were with him: We will go down, for there is space there, and we will take of these materials, and we will make an earth whereon these may dwell;

25 And we will prove them herewith, to see if they will do all things whatsoever the Lord their God shall command them;

26 And they who keep their first estate shall be added upon; and they who keep not their first estate shall not have glory in the same kingdom with those who keep their first estate; and they who keep their second estate shall have glory added upon their heads for ever and ever.

27 And the Lord said: Whom shall I send? And one answered like unto the Son of Man: Here am I, send me. And another answered and said: Here am I, send me. And the Lord said: I will send the first.

28 And the second was angry, and kept not his first estate; and, at that day, many followed after him.

Abraham 4:1
AND then the Lord said: Let us go down. And they went down at the beginning, and they, that is the Gods, organized and formed the heavens and the earth.

-We learn from cross referencing with other text that "the Gods" is referring to at least The Father and the Son. In verse 24 above, it states one that "was like unto God," who said let us go down - perhaps one of the "noble and great ones", like unto moses.

And then in verse 27, God asks whom shall I send? - meaning who will recieve their first estate (v. 26) - And one spoke "like unto the Son of Man", here I am send me.

Then the next verse, Abraham 4:1, says the Lord then said "let us go down."

Now these are two texts, basically telling the same thing, one having more detail than the other. This is no different than the main gospels of the Bible, Matt, Mak, Luke, John - they all tell the same thing but are not the same in account and detail.



To cross reference what was written above, for a better understanding, I qoute from the Book of Moses chapter 4:

1 AND I, the Lord God, spake unto Moses, saying: That Satan, whom thou hast commanded in the name of mine Only Begotten, is the same which was from the beginning, and he came before me, saying?Behold, here am I, send me, I will be thy son, and I will dredeem all mankind, that one soul shall not be lost, and surely I will do it; wherefore give me thine honor.

2 But, behold, my Beloved Son, which was my Beloved and Chosen from the beginning, said unto me?Father, thy will be done, and the glory be thine forever.

3 Wherefore, because that Satan rebelled against me, and sought to destroy the agency of man, which I, the Lord God, had given him, and also, that I should give unto him mine own power; by the power of mine Only Begotten, I caused that he should be cast down;

4 And he became Satan, yea, even the devil, the father of all lies, to deceive and to blind men, and to lead them ecaptive at his will, even as many as would not hearken unto my voice.


So God the Father did create all through His Son, Jesus Christ. And through this modern day translation by a prophet of God, we learn that at least one other help somehow, but the credit, glory and honor is due unto the Father for the creation.

When you say, Mormons believe "Gods" created the Earth, it insinuates that we believe in more than one God, which is false and misleading in a slanderous way, which judging from many of your other questions is what you were intending. The fact is we only believe in God the Father as the creater, Jesus our Savior by grace (not works - would you like me to qoute many scriptures from the Book of Mormon that will confirm this?) and Son, and in the Holy Ghost. All part of the Godhead, all one, but all seperate "entities," if you will.


I just want to say one more thing. This is pretty "heavy" scripture, and can often be misunderstood or misinterpreted, especially if not read with the spirit of God. Without reading such scripture with the spirit of God, you will not have His understanding. Things of teh spirit must be understood by the spirit. If you are reading these scriptures with the intent of "disproving" them, God will not offer you His spirit, and you will be left to your own understanding, and in many cases, to be manipulated by the enemy of God, the father of all lies, to further his cause in disrupting the things of God.

Make sense.

I hope this was helpful. And I hope it brings you the understading or answers that you seek or are looking for. What do you seek?
What are you looking for?

If it is to negate or discred, you will find sufficient to convince yourself of what you are looking for - but will that really satisfy you?

I suggest you:

a. study your own faith, religion, spirituality, etc. to strengthen it, and find satisfaction through this.

or

b. let go of your pride, your contentions, or whatever else it is you have build up that makes you so vengeful of the LDS church, and genuinly study these things you do not understand, with an openess. Pray. Say something like, "God, I think the Mormons are mislead, even down right ridiculous in their beliefs, but that is what I think, or have been taught to think, but I want to go by what you think. I am going to read the Book of Mormon and anything else that I have a problem with about the Mormons I am going to study materials written about these subjects by authorized Mormons, and I want you to guide me and let me know the truth. Even though I am totally against it, I am open to you and to your truths, and I will be open to what I learn, if it be your will. Please let me know. Please give me answers to my questions."

You know, something like that. Then see what happens. If you are lead to the same conclusion you have now, then you wont be anywhere but where you are now, and you will actually know what you are talking about. Then, forget about it, and study your beliefs, seeking truth.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 03-24-2009, 07:04 PM
zebiker's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,567
If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life. All you need is the Bible DO NOT be fooled by the Mormons "book"
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 03-27-2009, 07:04 PM
Dr. Zoom Zoom 3.0's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,637
Al-Ikhlas (Sincerity) (112) - Roukh 1
In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.
Say: He, Allah, is One. {1} Allah is He on Whom all depend. {2} He begets not, nor is He begotten. {3} And none is like Him. {4}


Al-Kafiroon (The Disbelievers, Atheists) (109) - Roukh 1
In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.
Say: O unbelievers! {1} I do not serve that which you serve, {2} Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve: {3} Nor am I going to serve that which you serve, {4} Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve: {5} You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion. {6}
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 04-01-2009, 07:04 PM
XXX's Avatar
XXX XXX is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,670
Since reading the hog wash from Mormons, I am convinced they and Dean Smith, their savior, are misguided and bound for hell fire. I believe David Koresh was also a Mormon who pretended to be a Christian.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 04-06-2009, 07:04 PM
Maggie H's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,629
i don't know.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2009, 07:04 PM
southernbelle540's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,593
Jehovah God is responsible for creating the earth
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2009, 07:04 PM
God Of The Godless's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,674
Who cares Mormons have made up some pagan cult that even they don't understand because of the lack in studying the Word Of God AKA Bible, Not their own bible. They need Jesus.
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 04-12-2009, 07:04 PM
ndg6991's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,501
the Mormon Church is based after the masons!!!! they are a cult and do not believe in the true God. do some research and you will see how the Mormon church and masons are linked together, another way to look at it is they have "moron" in their name? all the symbols are the same the church is laid out like a masonic hall creepy to me. God says he comes from the north they both show they do not believe in this by only putting light in the south,west and east of the rooms?
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Is biblical creation real or hinduism? Happy Human (((Debra))) Hinduism 17 06-29-2010 08:04 AM
Are there any religions besides christianity that take their creation myth as literal jeffchick1449 Christianity 13 05-25-2010 09:02 AM
Between Islam and Christianity, which religion has been responsible for the most viol DragonHeart Christianity 10 06-29-2009 08:50 AM
What was Catholic Church?s response to the creation of Protestantism? southernbelle540 Protestantism 18 07-07-2008 07:59 AM
Is it written that Islam will be responsible for the end of days??? redribbon. Islam 4 03-05-2008 05:51 PM

 
Forum Stats
Members: 14,010
Threads: 50,396
Posts: 543,312
Total Online: 65

Newest Member: telson7

Latest Threads

Advertisement